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	<title>Comments on: Are We Engineering Software or People?</title>
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	<link>http://pathfindersoftware.com/2009/02/are-we-engineering-software-or-people/</link>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://pathfindersoftware.com/2009/02/are-we-engineering-software-or-people/#comment-9296</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:09:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pathf.com/blogs/?p=1405#comment-9296</guid>
		<description>Science is always about increasing human knowledge.  Scientists look at areas that aren&#039;t understood, propose a hypothesis and then test the hypothesis with experiments.  After rigorous peer review, we&#039;re often left with formulas or processes that make very accurate predications.

Having scientific knowledge is useful because we often develop theories on how something should work and then we test it (isn&#039;t that Agile development?).  Electron flow in semi-conductors arranged into logic gates forms the bedrock of computing and is firmly rooted in the physical sciences.  However, is proposing a theory on how multiple processes can run on a collection of semi-conductor logic gates (or CPU chip), then testing that theory with an experiment called an OS kernel, an implementation of the scientific principle?

When developing software, do you ever catch yourself saying, &quot;In theory, we should be able to do X?&quot;  Then some software is built to prove it&#039;s possible, often that software is peer reviewed (code review).  As software developers, are we not very efficient scientists in our own niche scientific area, constantly hypothesising and testing?  We&#039;re probably fairly unique in that we end up selling our successful experiments as a product, that proves our hypothesis time and again!

Generally, when science makes it&#039;s discoveries and moves on, engineers take over and innovation follows.  As software developers, we are using well understood, genuine scientific discoveries in new creative ways.

I am a Computer Science graduate and I&#039;ve argued here that I am a computer scientist.  In my heart though, even though we push the boundaries of what&#039;s possible with computers, I know my staff and I are really talented (wannabe scientist) engineers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Science is always about increasing human knowledge.  Scientists look at areas that aren&#8217;t understood, propose a hypothesis and then test the hypothesis with experiments.  After rigorous peer review, we&#8217;re often left with formulas or processes that make very accurate predications.</p>
<p>Having scientific knowledge is useful because we often develop theories on how something should work and then we test it (isn&#8217;t that Agile development?).  Electron flow in semi-conductors arranged into logic gates forms the bedrock of computing and is firmly rooted in the physical sciences.  However, is proposing a theory on how multiple processes can run on a collection of semi-conductor logic gates (or CPU chip), then testing that theory with an experiment called an OS kernel, an implementation of the scientific principle?</p>
<p>When developing software, do you ever catch yourself saying, &#8220;In theory, we should be able to do X?&#8221;  Then some software is built to prove it&#8217;s possible, often that software is peer reviewed (code review).  As software developers, are we not very efficient scientists in our own niche scientific area, constantly hypothesising and testing?  We&#8217;re probably fairly unique in that we end up selling our successful experiments as a product, that proves our hypothesis time and again!</p>
<p>Generally, when science makes it&#8217;s discoveries and moves on, engineers take over and innovation follows.  As software developers, we are using well understood, genuine scientific discoveries in new creative ways.</p>
<p>I am a Computer Science graduate and I&#8217;ve argued here that I am a computer scientist.  In my heart though, even though we push the boundaries of what&#8217;s possible with computers, I know my staff and I are really talented (wannabe scientist) engineers.</p>
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		<title>By: Hugo</title>
		<link>http://pathfindersoftware.com/2009/02/are-we-engineering-software-or-people/#comment-9295</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Feb 2009 12:16:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pathf.com/blogs/?p=1405#comment-9295</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know If you read the &quot;Top Ten Sofware Engineering Reports&quot; presentantion by Ed Yourdon.

You can see in the concepts the importance of people and process and that technology is not the key issue in software development.

http://www.yourdonreport.com/index.php/2008/11/13/top-ten-software-engineering-concepts-v10/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know If you read the &#8220;Top Ten Sofware Engineering Reports&#8221; presentantion by Ed Yourdon.</p>
<p>You can see in the concepts the importance of people and process and that technology is not the key issue in software development.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.yourdonreport.com/index.php/2008/11/13/top-ten-software-engineering-concepts-v10/" rel="nofollow">http://www.yourdonreport.com/index.php/2008/11/13/top-ten-software-engineering-concepts-v10/</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Agile Ajax » Are We Engineering bSoftware/b or People? » Pathfinder b&#8230;/b &#171; topsoft.us</title>
		<link>http://pathfindersoftware.com/2009/02/are-we-engineering-software-or-people/#comment-9294</link>
		<dc:creator>Agile Ajax » Are We Engineering bSoftware/b or People? » Pathfinder b&#8230;/b &#171; topsoft.us</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 00:12:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pathf.com/blogs/?p=1405#comment-9294</guid>
		<description>[...] post:  Agile Ajax » Are We Engineering bSoftware/b or People? » Pathfinder b&#8230;/b   Share and [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] post:  Agile Ajax » Are We Engineering bSoftware/b or People? » Pathfinder b&#8230;/b   Share and [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Craig Buchek</title>
		<link>http://pathfindersoftware.com/2009/02/are-we-engineering-software-or-people/#comment-9293</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig Buchek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:46:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pathf.com/blogs/?p=1405#comment-9293</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d be willing to bet that the majority of engineers in other fields also deal with people issues more than technical engineering issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d be willing to bet that the majority of engineers in other fields also deal with people issues more than technical engineering issues.</p>
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		<title>By: James Heggs</title>
		<link>http://pathfindersoftware.com/2009/02/are-we-engineering-software-or-people/#comment-9292</link>
		<dc:creator>James Heggs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 09:04:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.pathf.com/blogs/?p=1405#comment-9292</guid>
		<description>Hi,

Its a coincidence you raise this point today!

I would describe my self as more of a Software Engineer but merely because of my qualification title. I finished a degree in Software Engineering not Computer Science is this possibly the only difference for me?? Yeah probably ;)

Also with you mentioning people making or breaking you I agree! Over recent weeks we have been having various discussion on management of clients - as a team we know we are all more than capable of getting the &#039;work done&#039; and to standards required but then how do you manage the clients&#039; expectations.

We develop web apps too and I always feel that because the client isn&#039;t getting &#039;something they can see&#039; - a product in a box they always seem to have higher expectations do you find this? If I was to buy a Blue pen from a shop a week later I wouldn&#039;t take it back and say actually I need it red and it ALSO needs to flash when I write? (After writing that sentence I feel somewhat harsh - so possibly as a caveat it may be that we need to tighten up our requirements gathering)

How do you manage their understanding that to make a website is actually not as easy as people think?

My initial thoughts and good blog by the way I have been subscribed for a few months now.

Eggsy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,</p>
<p>Its a coincidence you raise this point today!</p>
<p>I would describe my self as more of a Software Engineer but merely because of my qualification title. I finished a degree in Software Engineering not Computer Science is this possibly the only difference for me?? Yeah probably <img src='http://pathfindersoftware.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Also with you mentioning people making or breaking you I agree! Over recent weeks we have been having various discussion on management of clients &#8211; as a team we know we are all more than capable of getting the &#8216;work done&#8217; and to standards required but then how do you manage the clients&#8217; expectations.</p>
<p>We develop web apps too and I always feel that because the client isn&#8217;t getting &#8216;something they can see&#8217; &#8211; a product in a box they always seem to have higher expectations do you find this? If I was to buy a Blue pen from a shop a week later I wouldn&#8217;t take it back and say actually I need it red and it ALSO needs to flash when I write? (After writing that sentence I feel somewhat harsh &#8211; so possibly as a caveat it may be that we need to tighten up our requirements gathering)</p>
<p>How do you manage their understanding that to make a website is actually not as easy as people think?</p>
<p>My initial thoughts and good blog by the way I have been subscribed for a few months now.</p>
<p>Eggsy</p>
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